Transcript
INTRO (Music in background)
Megan Adams: In this episode, we’re speaking with Dr. Steph Ceraso, an assistant professor of digital writing and rhetoric in the English department at the University of Virginia. She earned her PhD with a concentration in composition literacy, pedagogy, and rhetoric from the University of Pittsburgh. Her research and teaching interests include multimodal composition, sound studies, pedagogy, digital rhetoric, disability studies, sensory rhetorics, music, and pop culture. In addition to coediting a sonic rhetorics issue of Harlot, she’s also published scholarship in College English, Rhetoric Society Quarterly, Composition Studies, enculturation, Peitho, Currents in Electronic Literacy, Sounding Out, and Provoke: Digital Sound Studies. Her book, Sounding Composition: Multimodal Pedagogies for Embodied Listening, proposes an expansive approach to teaching with sound in the composition classroom. We really hope that you enjoy this conversation with Steph as much we did. You might notice in it that there is some water flowing in the background. We were in the relaxation room at the 2017 FemRhet Conference, so we hope that this episode is relaxing but it also helps you learn a little bit about who Dr. Ceraso is, where she comes from, and what invigorates her work.
Steph Ceraso (CS) interviewed on October 5, 2017 at the Feminisms and Rhetorics Conference in Dayton, Ohio
Interviewer: Megan Adams (MA)
SC: I’m from Ford City, Pennsylvania, which is a town north of Pittsburgh, a small factory town under 3,000 people I believe now. So, it was really a small place to grow up. And I think what I got from that experience was just how important community is. It’s the kind of place that the whole community raises you, not just your parents. So, I had a ton of teachers and mentors and coaches that really encouraged me to do things—push myself. I think that support was really crucial.
MA: Have you seen that, you know, as a feminist and thinking about mentorship—do you see that reflected back in your work today at all?
SC: Yeah, absolutely. I think mentorship for me is one of the most important parts of being in academia. Like, I don’t think I would have survived without a network of mentors that I could depend on, and I tried to pay it forward, as well. Just from, you know, the kind of—I feel like I’ve been really lucky throughout my life of having really good mentors, and I try to pay that forward by being a good mentor to my own students. But also—this is something that Pamela VanHaitsma and I have written about—is sort of horizontal mentoring and peer mentoring, and how that is so important in terms of, you know, having mentors at different stages and different levels of their careers. Because senior scholars don’t always remember, you know, what it’s like going through the stages, and it’s great to have people that can relate to the stage that you’re at. So, I think it’s, yeah, mentorship is a huge part of being an academic for me.
So, Pamela and I have written an article for Peitho about horizontal mentoring, and basically, we just kind of studied our own mentoring relationship over a long period of time, from graduate school to our first book projects, and basically, we just kind of formalized our mentoring relationship, and we kind of give tips and strategies for other people who want to start peer mentoring that, you know, hopefully—we’re hoping that it will help them along the way, too, as much as it’s helped us.
MA: I think it’s great that you’re making that so visible, too, because I think that happens a lot, but maybe it’s not as visible. We don’t, maybe, think of as important as it might really be?
SC: Yeah. I feel like we definitely—I think our field is lucky, especially the Feminisms and Rhetorics community. I think there’s a lot of—a lot of emphasis on mentorship. In other fields, we’ve been getting feedback from people in other fields that are like, “Oh, nobody ever talks about this in our field this is, this is great,” you know. So, I think just having—being more explicit and transparent about how mentoring works is really crucial.
MA: Great, I’m going to backtrack a little bit.
SC: Sure.
MA: But could you tell us about your childhood?
SC: [laughs] This is getting deep!
MA: [laughs] I know, isn’t it? What did you want to be when you grow up?
SC: So, I was a super curious kid. I loved learning in school from the start. For instance, I got, like, my favorite Christmas present of all time was a desk. Like, I just wanted to do homework at my desk. And for a long time, I wanted to be an archaeologist. And this was, like, I was from a small town in western Pennsylvania; this is not like a common interest. I think I watched Indiana Jones too many times, and I was really serious about it the whole way through high school, and I actually looked at colleges that had archeology programs. But once I visited those colleges and saw what archaeologists actually do, it was much more boring than I anticipated, so I ended up not pursuing that, but that was a big, you know, interest of mine.
MA: So then how did you find the field of rhetoric and composition?
SC: So, I didn’t find rhetoric and composition in my undergraduate years at all because I went to a small liberal arts school called Washington and Jefferson College in Pennsylvania, and they didn't have a rhet/comp program. But I did major in English there after, like, a whole bunch of other majors first, and eventually my English professors at that school encouraged me to apply for a master's program, and I got into the University of Vermont, where I met Nancy Welch, who was teaching the pedagogy seminar because I was teaching for the first time, as well. So, she sort of introduced me to the field of rhet/comp.
So, I wasn’t even aware of what rhet/comp was, and to me, she was just talking about teaching and writing in such exciting ways that I didn’t even know you could study, like, teaching and writing, basically. So, she could see that I was really interested, and she really took me under her wing, you know, even after I graduated. I was—I took a few years off between my master’s and my PhD program. I wasn’t sure what I was going to do. But she continued to mentor me outside of school, and she helped me with my PhD application, so she really—I owe Nancy a lot for sort of pushing me to continue to pursue this.
I feel like because I didn’t come from, you know, a super strong—like, nobody in my family went to graduate school. I just—I didn’t come from that, like, an academic life. So, and I don’t think many people do. So, I came, you know, to college I was—I felt a little bit underprepared in college. And then the same thing with my master’s degree I was kind of like, “What is theory?” Like, “This is all very confusing.” So, that part of my life where Nancy was really encouraging was helpful. But I also like . . . in my PhD program, it happened again. I feel like that imposter syndrome happens at every level. [laughs] The higher you go, the worse it gets. And so, Jess Enoch was also a really big mentor for me in my PhD program. And I just—I think you need people to tell you, “This is what this is.” I mean, it’s a very confusing experience, and there’s a lot of self-doubt throughout the process. And I think to have, like, not just one mentor but a network of mentors that can . . . you can kind of go to for different things, to explain what is going on basically at different points of your career. And also to help your scholarship really develop and help you understand what it means to be a scholar. I think, you know, I’m really grateful for, like I said, for all the mentors I’ve had in the field.
MA: Are there any, like, specific moments or stories that stick out to you that you’re just like, “That was a moment where . . . I remember this moment or this place where I got it, or I felt like I could write this, or do this research, or be here?”
SC: [laughs] I honestly don’t have one because I still feel . . . I still feel underprepared in a lot of ways, even though, you know, I have a tenure-track job, and I’ve been really lucky in many, many ways. But I don’t think I’ve ever felt completely comfortable or like I totally get what this academic thing is. But I think that there have been ways—so, I guess there’s no way to get out of imposter syndrome, and I really think that most people have it. But I think what you can do is just realize that most people have—become more aware that you’re not alone in this and that, I think, relying on those mentors becomes more and more important. Even at every stage of your career—like even if you have tenure, you know—you’re still always working toward something else. You’re always becoming hopefully a more rigorous scholar and sort of learning along the way. And you need people to help you do that.
MA: What’s your best piece of advice for someone who may be a grad student or entering the field, and I know, like, you know, you go to, like, the four Cs, and it’s almost completely overwhelming. Maybe this person doesn’t have a mentor yet? What advice do you have for them in terms of just finding a foot in the field? Or just finding their place?
SC: I would say just start with your peers. Like I said with Pamela. I mean, it’s been a really . . . Like, the people that you go to graduate school with, I think, are going to be your friends and mentors hopefully throughout your career. Those are the people that you sort of learn and grow with during your program. Those are great resources. Those people will continue to, you know, form panels with you and and, you know, you can expand your network over time. But I think starting with a peer is easy—something easy that you can do if you’re less, you know, if you’re afraid to approach, maybe, senior scholars in the field at this point. I think, you know, just developing a support system is really crucial early on. I think that a lot of people don’t finish programs or fall through the cracks because they don’t feel supported enough. And I think, again, getting a diverse network of people is important, but starting even with your peers is one way to kind of explore the field together rather than feel like you’re going at it alone.
I honestly don't know if I’ve found my voice yet. Like, I think that this a . . . you know, I think I’m still learning. I’m the scholar but still learning. And I’m an early-career person right now, and I’m still sort of figuring out what I want to continue to study. And I think that thinking about this as sort of, like, finding something or like, “Now I’ve got it,” is maybe an approach that makes you feel less confident. But I think if you think about this as a process for everybody that’s a learning process throughout your career, I think it’s a lot—you put a lot less pressure on yourself to sort of, like, “I figured everything out now.” Like, I don’t think there’s that moment. That doesn’t happen to anybody that I know. So, I think just in terms of, like, how mentoring’s affected my writing, though, I’ve collaborated with a lot of people on articles and other things, and I feel like I learned the most through collaborative writing because you get a sense of other people’s styles. You read more, you learn from each other, kind of taking different perspectives and trying to combine them is really challenging. So, I love collaborating with people, and I think that’s one way that I’ve grown as a writer, and I encourage . . . especially graduate students to collaborate, especially at the beginning of their careers because I think it’s a great—you can, I mean, to me, collaboration is an important feminist ethic as well as a digital, like pedagogical . . . anybody who works with digital media knows the importance of collaboration. And so, I think you can frame this in your letter to your tenure or promotion committees about, sort of, that this isn’t just a thing I do because it’s easier. Oftentimes, collaboration is harder for me to do because you really do have to kind of think together and figure out how your ideas are going to work. And that doesn’t always happen easily, especially if you have different writing styles or approaches to writing. So, to me, it’s always a really big learning experience and I tried to, well, I guess I will try to frame collaboration as an important part of my identity as a scholar. But I also understand that I’m going to have to, I think, that—you can’t do everything collaborative because the system is not set up that way. I mean, I think that you can get in trouble if that’s all you do. So, you have to make sure that you’re still advancing your own work. But I think you can take collaboration and make it more legible as something that’s real scholarly work to committees. And hopefully that will be the case for me. This is, again, hypothetical. [laughs]
MA: And this one we kind of talked about already, but I would be really interested to hear this, too. Like, do you have any suggestions for young women, particularly, who are entering the field? How can they be successful, or, again, this kind of goes back to the “How they can find their footing?” question. But I think it is a little bit different for women. And again, it probably depends on what your area is, because the field is so large, but . . . ?
SC: Yeah, I mean, I feel like I’m being, you know, I’m a broken record at this point. But I really do think that the best thing that—especially young women—academics can do is find a network of mentors. It’s a hard thing. Academia is hard to navigate no matter who you are. And I think it’s especially difficult for women. And so, again, the mentorship thing is really important throughout the whole process. I’m not sure. I think the one thing I would say, and I don’t know if this is really advice or anything, but I think you asked earlier about, like, work-life balance, and I don’t think that’s a thing, either. I think that’s kind of a myth, and I think women seeking other female mentors is crucial because they might have to help you with things like, “How do you approach your chair about maternity leave?” or, “I’m having these health issues; I’m not sure what to do about it.” You might not feel comfortable telling that to somebody else. So, I think, you know, developing a system of mentors that can actually . . . that have been through these things before, that understand what it’s like to be a woman in these situations is a really important thing to do.
MA: Definitely, and then we talked about this, too, but who has been . . . has there been anyone or any group of women who has been, like, you’ve looked at as, like, the rock star or the inspiration for you?
SC: I think it’s dangerous to call people rock stars, but I understand the impulse. I think that just being at Feminisms and Rhetorics and seeing so many successful, accomplished, female academics is always inspirational, and that’s one of the reasons I keep coming back to this conference. Even though my work isn’t specifically about gender or feminism, I feel that when I come here, it’s a positive, energetic experience, and it reminds me of how many women have succeeded in the field. So, for me, that’s why I keep coming back. And also, they’re doing great work, and it’s interesting to see the range of work that people are doing.
In terms of personal mentors, I’ve kind of already said Nancy Welch, obviously, but Jess Enoch has been a real inspiration. I think that—I’ve known her for a long time, so I’ve seen her navigate family and multiple jobs and multiple books, and she’s very explicit, and she is very transparent about how she’s done that with her mentees. And I think that that’s something that I try to model. I try to emulate her example with my own students to sort of . . . because it’s been so important for me to have that example, and she has been so generous about sharing how she’s been able to do all these things with her students. So I think Jess is a special mentor to me. But I really do value so many women in the field, and it’s exciting to be here.
MA: Could you maybe share some of . . .
SC: But also just being transparent about, you know, what the—what the book publishing process is like and things that people that haven’t done them yet . . . it’s completely unclear how to move forward or what happens. And just kind of having people that will be willing to share that information with you and to kind of help you navigate all of the bureaucratic parts of academia, as well as, like, becoming a scholar. I think it’s, you know, it’s a really important thing to have that kind of support.
MA: And you don’t have to answer this, but is there anything, like, tangible or any, like, big piece of—a particular piece of advice that you got from any one of your mentors that just sticks out to you that has helped you, that you think might help other people in any way? I know that’s, again, that’s putting you on the spot a little bit.
SC: Yeah . . . I mean, I think . . . I don’t even know who—I’m sure multiple people have told me this—but I think when I was in graduate school, I was really worried that it was . . . all of my life felt really . . . I was putting so much time into graduate school, and I felt my life . . . There was no balance whatsoever, and I was really worried about trying to achieve the perfect balance or something, and that’s where this sort of, like, work-life balance thing is, I think, a myth. But people said, you know, you’re—there are never going to be parts of your life that are all—absolutely everything is going well in every area of your life. That doesn’t happen.
So, some good advice I got was, like, what you can control is, you know, take fifteen minutes or an hour a day. Use that for your writing time. Use that to take a nap. Use that to do activism. But if you just—you can control sort of how you use your time on a daily basis. And, although you may not control these bigger issues, and there—it may feel like, I guess, imbalanced in some ways—you can sort of make room for things. And that was a really comforting thing in terms of just, like, “Yeah, I can control,” you know, “I’ll write a half an hour every morning before work.” And that is actually, you know—having that sort of writing habit has been really important. So, kind of just forgetting about try to balancing—like, try to balance everything—but actually just do small little things in your schedule that, I think . . . You can really change the way that you approach work and life. And also just kind of taking breaks. I mean, this is something that Jess has reminded me a lot. It’s okay to take breaks. You don’t have to work all weekend. You can take off in the evenings, like, you don't have to work 24/7.
And I will—I will admit that I used to try to do that. And then, when I stopped doing that, and I actually took, like, weekends—I mean it’s not always possible, of course—but most evenings and weekends off, like, I feel like I’m definitely more productive during the week just from doing that. So, I would say it’s okay not to work. I think there’s these, you know, cultural narratives that we have to be busy, and we have to be productive constantly. And it’s really—it's unhealthy, I think, to do that. And I—I’ve just found that I’m much more productive and focused when I do take breaks, so I think if I had to give advice to anybody that's a graduate student coming up, I would just say it’s okay to not work all the time.
MA: I think that still applies to us now. [laughs]
SC: Yeah!
MA: Like, I still—that it’s a conscious decision, right, to be, well, this is, like, for me it’s—I’m a morning writer, too, but this is, like, my time. And if I don’t start my day like this, then the anxiety starts to, like, creep in, and so, I think that that’s really great advice. And you kind of answered this—work/life/activism—but I’m curious to know, too, so this is interesting to talk to you, ‘cause given your work. So, you talk a lot about listening, so I think, gosh, that does require us to slow down to a certain extent, right? And there is the cultural narrative of being busy, and we’re in this place where there’s lots of things happening all at once, so how do you—do you practice that? Because that’s, like, your theory is about listening . . .
SC: Sure.
MA: . . . and kind of doing many of these things . . .
SC: I mean, I try to. I think it’s really difficult, you know, and I am definitely guilty of, sort of, constantly jamming my earbuds in and consuming content. You know, I love podcasts and that sort of thing. But I do try to make time in my day to just focus and sort of practice listening in a really, like, in a meditative kind of way. But I also think I try to practice it in, like, in real situations, not just as I’m, like, meditating or something but in the classroom, I just try to be really present and really listen to students in a full way as opposed to just kind of getting through the lesson or something like that. So, I think it does show up in my teaching and just in terms of mentoring. I think it’s important; listening is a big part of mentoring, and a lot of times, I don’t talk very much in mentoring sessions with students. They sort of do the talking and then we talk about strategies at the end. But, you know, yeah, listening has definitely informed, like—my research was informed the way I approach, I guess, mentoring and teaching, for sure.
MA: Could you talk more about that? Are there any, like, specific instances or specific strategies that you employ? Because I think, and again, this is a selfish question, too. I find myself being, like, really overwhelmed and rushed when I try to mentor students. I don’t know if it’s my cultural background—I’m Italian—so it’s like the constant, like, you have to, like, jump in.
SC: Same.
MA: [laughs]
SC: Yeah.
MA: And so, I wonder sometimes how to break out of that and how to be a more conscious listener.
SC: I feel like it is a conscious decision, and I think this is one of the things I kind of talk about in my research is that listening is something we take for granted constantly, right? We just assume that—especially when we’re teaching with sound or teaching content—we just assume that playing the sound is enough, like people will listen if they hear it. And that’s not the case. I feel like, especially, if I’m doing a whole bunch of other stuff and then I rush over to a classroom and I’m not, I don't take ten minutes before the class and kind of center myself and be prepared to listen, then I tend to rush through what I’m saying, and I’m not—I’m not listening to students completely. Like, I feel like you have to make a deliberate decision to really be focused and listen in a way that’s generous, and it’s hard to do because we're so used to just constantly moving from one thing to the next, and we want to rush through things. But listening requires sort of slowing down and really paying attention to not just what people were saying but the whole—their body language, all of the other factors that shape a listening situation.
MA: And so, you think that just even that five or ten minutes before class and after, maybe? I don’t want to assume that, but does that really help in that? Maybe that’s, like, one specific strategy, I guess?
SC: Sure, or just even kind of saying to yourself, like, “I’m not going to talk”; like, “I’m gonna let my students talk for at least ten minutes before I intervene,” or just kind of have these little tricks. Even in a mentoring meeting, you know, with one of your mentees, give them the time to—like, don’t jump in, even if you have that impulse. Like, let that—what they’re trying to say—unfold instead of just kind of cutting them off and giving them advice immediately. Kind of thinking about it as a conversation, which is part of, you know, why listening is important as well.
MA: Great. Thank you. And then, switching gears a little bit again, so what are your best writing tips? This is something else we wanted to know from scholars who are doing the work and getting published.
SC: Yeah. I’m reluctant to give tips because I do feel like people develop their own sort of strategies, and everybody’s a little bit different. This is something that Pamela and I have talked about a lot. Some people get a lot from writing every day and protecting their writing time, and I definitely do that during certain times, if I have a project I need to do. But I find that sometimes I just need a break from writing completely and I need to read, which we—it’s hard to pack in time, a lot of time—to do that. So, I would say just pay attention to when you’re most productive. Like, the time of day—when are you most focused?—and try to reserve that time for either doing some sort of rigorous intellectual work, whether it be writing or reading or whatever.
But I would say the biggest thing, if I had to give a tip, is just protect that time, regardless if it’s part of your daily schedule. If you make it a habit, it will just come naturally, and you just, sort of—that’s what you do during that time. And you can say the same thing about scheduling time off, right? I actually write that in my calendar, like, “take these hours off” or whatever. Do something that’s not related to work because I think that if I don’t do that, I tend to just use that time and go right back into the work or something like that. So yeah, time is really important for me as a writer. I mean, it’s hard to find it, especially the more you take on your career. It’s just really difficult to find that time. And so, protecting it at all costs is for me the most, I guess, productive strategy.
For me, my teaching and research are very entwined. And so a lot of my ideas for my scholarship is pedagogical. So I try to use the classroom as a space—even if it’s, even if I wasn’t writing pedagogical research or research, like on courses that are about other topics, I try to use courses as a way to explore new ideas myself with students, so that if I’m writing a paper on whatever, like remixes or something, I could talk to students or come up with a reading list that would be beneficial both to my research and to the students in that class. So that way, it’s sort of—you’re not doing all the work that’s separate from teaching, but you’re sort of learning along with students and giving yourself at least, like, scaffolding a little bit so that you have time to read. And it’s not extra additional work—it’s kind of lumped in with your daily job of teaching.
MA: That’s great advice too, Steph. Can you tell us, too, also about what you’re working on now? What’s your latest research? Anything in the field that’s inspiring you or making you think more?
SC: Ah, man, so many things! I mean, the biggest thing I’m working on is finishing my first book project, which is about multimodal listening and sort of listening as a practice, a multisensory practice, and I’m trying to forward a theory or pedagogy of listening for the twenty-first century. So, how can we teach students to be sort of more savvy, attuned authors of digital work, but also just how do they engage with sound in more critical ways in their lives? So that’s—that’s coming out hopefully soon.
MA: Congratulations!
SC: Thanks! And yeah, other areas that are exciting to me—I’m kind of in between projects, and so, I’m kind of figuring out what to do next, but the area of sensory rhetorics to me is very exciting, and I think there’s a lot of work coming out that is giving me all kinds of ideas. And so I would really like to maybe explore that area a little bit more. But I don’t have any specific projects right now that I’m comfortable enough to talk about in any detail. But yeah, I think there’s always things going on in the field, and I think that’s why it’s such a great field to be in—there are so many different areas that are constantly producing new stuff. And so, I have trouble kind of focusing on one thing, and it takes me awhile to develop projects because of that.
MA: I’m the same way! Yeah . . . anything else you want to add? We got through all of our questions, but—
SC: Thank you so much. It’s so nice to talk to you, and it’s an honor to be asked. And yeah, that’s all.